Curse

Chev of Hardass · Dec 11, 2005, 10:19 PM // 22:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kate Bloodspirit

The faction cap is healthy for the metagame, because it slows down the introduction of new skills into the metagame in PvP.

/unsigned

This guy forgot about people like this guy:

Quote:

Originally Posted by E Power

<<< doesn't care because im going to be buying every skill a few days after c2 comes out

Who PvEs and has the skill points and gold to instanly unlock all the skills.

So, why is it better to unlock every skill instantly with PvE and not PvP?

darkdragon99 · Dec 11, 2005, 10:22 PM // 22:22

that guys doesn't know you will have to go to the end of c2 to be able to buy all of the new skills

oh wait and then there is the ones you have to cap to get not buy

Kate Bloodspirit · Dec 11, 2005, 10:38 PM // 22:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chev of Hardass

This guy forgot about people like this guy:

Who PvEs and has the skill points and gold to instanly unlock all the skills.

So, why is it better to unlock every skill instantly with PvE and not PvP?

There's much different to have a skill unlocked with 20k Xp than 1k faction, what is that? like 3 matches in underworld?

And if that person's got N points in his PvE account, what are the chances for him to jump into PvP anyways.

Loviatar · Dec 11, 2005, 11:12 PM // 23:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chev of Hardass

I have been capped out for months. It is a real load of crap that faction has absolutely no use after unlock, and you cannot save it.

Then there is another choice for the spender. Either unlock on opening day, or finnaly get that fissure armor.

/signed

and that is exactly why you have as much chance of getting that as an UAS/X button.

seriously the main problem is a misapprehension the PVP crowd is laboring under that faction is an *EARNED REWARD FOR PVP*

it is not a reward it is only an alternate tool to PVE unlocking

lets settle it by getting rid of faction and letting everybody do PVE .

then have the choice of spending the gold on PVP items or 15k for example

the PVP reward is rank and fame

the PVE reward is the vanity items like 15k etc

FACTION IS A TOOL (NOT A REWARD) TO UNLOCK IN PVP RATHER THAN PVE TO EARN YOUR PVP REWARD OF FAME/RANK AND NOTHING MORE.

Chev of Hardass · Dec 11, 2005, 11:12 PM // 23:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkdragon99

that guys doesn't know you will have to go to the end of c2 to be able to buy all of the new skills

oh wait and then there is the ones you have to cap to get not buy

How hard is it to go through PvE in this game? Really easy. Rush through and grab the skills. Except that means that players are forced back into the mundane. Nuke, hack and Heal party coming from and E/Mo

And if you collect all the Non-Elite skills using faction to unlock the Elites is far easier.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kate Bloodspirit

There's much different to have a skill unlocked with 20k Xp than 1k faction, what is that? like 3 matches in underworld?

And if that person's got N points in his PvE account, what are the chances for him to jump into PvP anyways.

!5k faction, not 20K. I see you do not PvE much, or keep up with the updates. Good luck next time.

My faction is capped and my warrior has earned 170 skill points. I never farmed much, but I know that some people have over 100 skill points that are unused. What are the chances? Probably good, lets keep speculating.

Fact: Earning faction takes time. I "earn" faction every battle, but GW does not let me have it.

Fact: By capping faction, A.Net is stating that we want you to grind for the new skills. It would not be grind if there was not cap on faction, because we could save it up at our leisure, but since we have to wait for a certian date and then start collection faction it becomes grind.

Fact: Forcing people to grind ruins the game for people trying to enjoy it. PvPers will rush through Ch2 and make PvEers miserable. PvPers will cap the Elite skill and leave the party and PvEers will complain. The Arenas will fill back up with people entering mission and leaving in the hopes that they can get a little faciton in their free time. GvG will fill with Smurf guilds that will do nothing but gank.

Believe it.

Mahanaxar · Dec 11, 2005, 11:48 PM // 23:48

/signed

I don't care really, but if this makes pvp players happy, why not?

But a big /not signed on pve rewards like ectos or fow armor unlockable with faction.
No way.

Obus · Dec 11, 2005, 11:58 PM // 23:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hiryu

I agree. Instead, why don't they implement a conversion system?

Maybe something like:
15,000 faction - 1 Glob of Ectoplasm
5,000 faction - 1 Obsidian Shard
250 faction - 10 Bolts of Cloth

And so on..

signed

Undivine · Dec 12, 2005, 01:17 AM // 01:17

The first time you play through a game is not supposed to be a "grind" you know. In PvE, we can zip through the campagn if we want because we know all the ins and outs of it. We know where to go, how to kill everything, so on, so forth. We've taken in all the visual consumption and heard the story thoroughly. Chapter 2 will be new. When it comes out, I will actually have to play the game. Imagine that?

Here is the point of denying people what they want: games are ment to tease. The Zelda series (and Metroid series) tease you with entrances and things that look like you could explore, but can't because you don't yet have the right equipment. A lot of games (including Guild Wars) entertain with the tease of more to come. This is the reason for level progression, unlockable skills, etc. At some point, there's just nothing more to tease with. The game is over then. There is a finite amount of stuff the developers can put into a game. Thus they bring out an expansion with more tease.

What you're talking about is finishing the expansion very very rapidly. It's like reading the last few pages of a book before you read the story leading up to it, or having the ending of a movie spoiled to you. And that goes against what the developers are trying to achieve. You can remove the cap and have your sense of accomplishment now (even though you don't even know what skills they're teasing you with yet), and then Chapter 2 will be a waste, with the only accomplishment you get is knowing you paid money to unlock stuff. Or you could start anew in Chapter 2 and actually have a refresh of accomplishments that should acompany a new expansion.

Keep in mind, in PvE the skill points we build up are on a per-character basis. We cannot play an Assassin primary without starting again. Even with an Assassin secondary, we have to actually find the skills first, and that's done through playing the game, not grinding. Our supposed "wealth" of money doesn't change that either (though, just yesterday I had exactly 1 gold piece accross all my characters and storage). So don't argue that PvE gets everything easier.

Chev of Hardass · Dec 12, 2005, 01:40 AM // 01:40

Undivine, you are right. The first time through should be a fun and new experiance, filled with new adventures and sceanery.

However, this experiance will be destroyed, if PvPers are only able to get the skills through PvE, or farming faction.

My first four times attempting to complete Hell's Precipace were plagued with people capping skills and leaving. Undead Rurik was the last charcter I could kill in the mission with a full team. Chapter 2 will have the same problems as chapter 1 did at the rate that things are likely to turn out.

Additionally, my concerns of GvG smurfs and ganking for extremely fast faction gains, and arena leeching are very real.

The answer to keeping PvE from having these problems is to keep the desire for people to cause these problems out.

Perhaps a unlimited cap is not the answer, but raising the cap to the level that will limit these problems is a very good answer.

unienaule · Dec 12, 2005, 01:50 AM // 01:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by YellowMarker161

Oh, but PvE'rs, they definately deserve to have as many skill points as they want!!! I mean, they grinded and grinded and grinded, and they deserve to be able to unlock all the skills when Chapter 2 comes out.

As many people have previously stated, the NPC's with "Get xyz as your seconday" will probably not show up in the desert, therefore, your logic makes no sense. PvEers will not be able to do any of what you just mentioned without going through the game normally once first.

Nigy · Dec 12, 2005, 02:16 AM // 02:16

/signed but to raise it to 60k ish

glenn_rolfe · Dec 12, 2005, 02:30 AM // 02:30

GAME TYPE REWARD

pvp Rank/fame
Ladder position
Jessica Alba

pve Fissure armour
Rosanne Barr

chris_nin00 · Dec 12, 2005, 02:49 AM // 02:49

/not signed

Kool Pajamas · Dec 12, 2005, 02:59 AM // 02:59

/////NOT signed 5 times

E Power · Dec 12, 2005, 03:01 AM // 03:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chev of Hardass

This guy forgot about people like this guy:

Who PvEs and has the skill points and gold to instanly unlock all the skills.

So, why is it better to unlock every skill instantly with PvE and not PvP?

I would actually create the character because I could have all the skills in a week, with ascension. Then I am set for pvp.

{IceFire} · Dec 12, 2005, 03:27 AM // 03:27

/signed

darkdragon99 · Dec 12, 2005, 03:33 AM // 03:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by glenn_rolfe

GAME TYPE REWARD

pvp Rank/fame
Ladder position
Jessica Alba

pve Fissure armour
Rosanne Barr

that little bunch of butt spoo is y these topics keep poping up and ppl keep fighting

Red Sonya · Dec 12, 2005, 06:21 AM // 06:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by unienaule

As many people have previously stated, the NPC's with "Get xyz as your seconday" will probably not show up in the desert, therefore, your logic makes no sense. PvEers will not be able to do any of what you just mentioned without going through the game normally once first.

And what makes you so absolutely sure about this? Did you get this from the dev's mouth? They should certainly be in the desert just like all the others.

And I will be a W/A within the day. hehe And rush to Hell to buy all the skills lol.

Just teasing you.

Some people just take this "game" just too darn seriously, everyone is afraid that someone else is going to get the upper hand or advantage and you all know when it comes to PVP it's about your OWN SKILLS and OWN INTELLIGENCE and not so much your equpment or skill bar.

Sol_Vie · Dec 12, 2005, 06:33 AM // 06:33

/notsigned

I gotta agree with the C2 argument...

Chev of Hardass · Dec 12, 2005, 06:46 AM // 06:46

Well I guess I cannot wait to see the entire guild wars population playing one of two (?) more professions through the game as soon as Ch2 releases.

I guess we can plan on knowing if there are any Assassin based abusive builds from that fiasco.

Kind of sounds like fun, as I type it.